A Tiger Rock Black Belt Has Challenged Me To A Real Fight, Not That Gay Sparring Stuff

        Today on my own blog, White Dragon Dojang Taekwondo & Martial Arts Blog, yours truly, White Dragon, has been challenged to a fight by a butthurt, Tiger Rock black belt who did not like my criticism about his mcdojang organization that he is a member of. This is typical of Tiger Rock students. It is not the first time a Tiger Rock student has challenged me to a fight. This likely will go nowhere and will never happen as most people who issue internet challenges never go through with them. Especially when there is no way I need to go to his address and fight him. If anyone wants to fight they can come to me here. I also do not really accept challenges or seek them out. But I will on the other hand fight delusional mcdojangers. It has never happened yet.

        Such people cannot reasonably argue a point, use observable evidence, or logic to argue their grievance. It is pure emotion and no discipline. In the blog article Tiger Rock’s Claim Of Accredited Instructors Is Meaningless you will see Mr. Miles Williams (who can also be found on Facebook easily through google by typing his name + “tiger rock” if you want to see his photo) state the following:

And if you want me to get personal, I do kyokushin and muay thai and the body conditioning is beyond your comprehension👌 and I know I’m not the only person in tiger rock that does body conditioning. Again… I’m friends with alit of students. Including our grandmaster ( who is a grandmaster by the way). Look ill give you my damn address and we can see who wins. And I don’t mean that gay sparring. I mean a real fight… In a ring… With nothin but gloves. I would really love to see your stupid sport face my style of tkd anyway. (sic)

Uh oh, I better be scared. Tiger Rock is SERIOUS business. I could end up fighting the NEXT Karate kid Miles Williams!

To see the full arguments in the comments please click the article link above and enjoy some comedy. I stand by my original blog post because it is full of observable evidence and facts about what Tiger Rock is, and why their claim of “instructor accreditation” is a joke.

Oh noz! He trains da MMAz at tiger rock!!!

Yes, Tiger Rock is not a mcdojang, but serious business and REAL fighting!

        I find it funny that he is going to show how badass his “Taekwondo” style is by using “Kyokushin” and “Muay Thai” on me, in a REAL fight, in a ring with NOTHING but gloves on. I hope he does not mean we should fight naked with only gloves. (well he did say “not that gay sparring” so hopefully he means we will wear clothes). He wants a REAL fight that is not sport, but it will still be in a ring and with gloves, the same stuff that combat sports always use. You know beause REAL fights are not sport, yet they they occur with sporty stuff like gloves and in rings. Also, this guy claimed he fights MMA. OH WE GOT A BADASS OVER HERE!

        There is no reason I need to fight this guy, and of course he will not follow through. I believe everything he claimed is not even true and simply made up. I doubt he trains in anything but Tiger Rock crap. Last I heard Tiger Rock does not give Kyokushin or Muay Thai certifications. But they do give a crapload of cirtifications of copy cat “grappling” that is the mcdojang style of Brazilian Jiu Jitsu.

        If he did want to show up I would easily win. Mcdojangism breeds a delusional cult mentality, and egocentric black belts and instructors who really know nothing about martial arts. They only know their corporate mcdojang programs they paid an extreme amount of money to be certified in.

        Martial arts will always be criticized by people in and out of the martial world (suck it up Miles!) The Kukkiwon style of Taekwondo especially recieves tons of criticism and insults. You don’t see much of us walking around challenging people to fights on the internet. It is called “getting over it” and “self control.” This dude came to the wrong blog. This blog openly states it is not friendly toward mcdojangs. He needs to get over it and walk away. Which he did apparently….I hope.

Well, apparently he DID find his limit and backed out. Typical. YAY!

         Go to the blog article and read it, then read the comments and see the hilarity.

  1. Jenkyn says:

    Okay I’m hyped. Will there be video footage? Do you two live near enough to each other that meeting up would be feasible?

    • White Dragon says:

      No. There will be no video footage, and we do not live near each other and it would not be feasible. That is exactly why the dork challenged me because he knew nothing would come of it.

      I made this post to show you the mcdojang mentality. In the past though Tiger Rock people in my city did challenge me to a fight over the internet. I kept refusing for along time and all they did was insult me and makeup tons of lies. Later, I then accepted but then they made excuses and backed out. It is typical.

      But this guy who posted on my blog article and challenged me lives in Kansas I think.

      I do not accept internet fights really or care to fight because it is highly pointless most often. It is immature to challenge people. I don’t need to do that. Logic and reason stands alone it would not matter if I fought them. Tiger Rock is everything I said it was. It is the rejected son of the ATA.

      • Jonathan says:

        Good for you. These bozos have such fragile egos.

      • White Dragon says:

        I think partly their egos are so huge is because of the mcdojang environment that gives false confidence to people. It is a form of brainwashing. The whole “You can do it! You are a black belt!!!” type of nonsense said over and over.
        Also, they are delusional because they refuse a reality check and refuse to fight people outside of their clubs. They do not want to know that they are not actually high level martial artists. They also refuse to acknowledge their false linage of Taekwondo and faulty system. They have paid a ton of money into their system and if they back out now it would mean the 10’s of thousands of dollars over the years, maybe even 100 thousand over time would have all been a waste of money. This is one reason they are so quick to defend their system.
        Also, their cult mentality and the identity of being in their organization is another problem. If they find out their mcdojang organization sucks it would mean that they suck as well. They cannot allow that. Instead of doing what other honest people do, such as quitting the organization and joining a real martial arts gym and starting at white belt again, their egos are too big to let them.
        They dont want to admit they are less than black belt or master levels. They have no humility to quit and start over at white belt in a real martial art.

  2. anonymous says:

    I am a Tiger Rock Instructor and I to have some of the same feelings. You are right that for a Tiger Rock black belt to challenge you to a fight over an disagreement over what you feel is extremely juvenile and displays no honor. I do not own my own school, but hope to someday. Please realize, that not all Tiger Rock Instructors are like that. I’ve been doing TaeKwonDo for over 25 now and I worked hard at it. I love the art and I am trying to instill that love on to my students as well the honor and integrity that’s supposed to come with it. I am getting the same feelings, that this organization is turning into a mcdojo. I do not get paid for what I do, the only reason why I’m staying, its not for me or my instructor but for my students. I grew a close bond with them and would love to see them grow up into happy adults. I am hoping that someday I will get up in rank so I can make positive changes to the Tiger Rock organization. I grew up with this organization before it became Tiger Rock, when it was a huge challenge to get your black belt and it breaks my heart to see what it has become. But please don’t lose hope in our organization for there are a few of us who truly trying to make it a better organization. The kind that will challenge you to not only be a better martial artist, but it better person as well. To have honor, integrity, and perseverance.

    • White Dragon says:

      I appreciate your respectful comment. I agree that not every TR black belt or instructor sucks. Its the same for ATA, some are good as well.

      The thing is these organizations milk out the good ones for everything they are worth and use them to be the face for their groups in various regions. But the truth is the average black belt and the curriculum itself is really bad. It is also not true Taekwondo and has no links to Korea or anything the KTA ever did.
      but this does not mean you cannot protect yourself because you are an individual who workls hard for yourself despite the limitations of your organization.

      What I would do if I were you is find a Kukkiwon affiliated gym and rank up in black belt ranks and start teaching the Taekwondo that Korea actually trains in and transfer over. It is tough to do this since you trained for 25 years and would not be able to be instructor rank in Kukkiwon but it is worth it. I am sure you could find a local sabum who would be willing to honor an instructor rank locally and help you get 1st-2nd dan and over time 3rd and 4th dan in kukkiwon and you would know the system.
      If you lived near me and were willing to do this I would do that for you. But hopefully you do this and study the Kukkiwon textbook.

      Anyway I understand your feelings for your students and how hard you worked.

      Have a great day and stick around this blog and keep reading. You might find more interesting things. See you later!

      • anonymous says:

        What do you think of being ITF certified ?

      • White Dragon says:

        Why not? If that is what you have around you why not? I would probably do it if I had no other options. I just understand its history and refuse to worship general choi. If I had the opportunity I would probably do it just to say I know it. I do know many of the tul. I used to know all up to 2nd dan but forgot a lot. I like Chunjee and Hwa Rang as forms. They are pretty solid. I also like kwan gae. My 9th dan Kukkiwon instructor taught me Kwan Gae when I got 2nd dan. But we did not do sine wave and I refuse to do sine wave because it’s stupid.

      • anonymous says:

        What do you think about being ITF certified?

  3. annonymous says:

    Hi. I see that this is an old post, but, it came up in the research I was doing on Tiger Rock and so I’d like to get your input. My kids have been part of TR for several years. My ten year old is on the cusp of receiving his probationary black belt. My 8 year old has his brown belt. To be honest, I’ve been getting more and more dissatisfied with the curriculum every time I watch a class or sit through a belt testing. Watching all these kids get promoted when clearly they shouldn’t upsets me to a certain extent. This includes my youngest son. He is okay, but, a brown belt?? They promote so easily and quickly that even if the child does a sloppy job on that stupid form they are forced to do, but, manages to sort of get the positions correct, they are moved forward and given the next belt. I’ve watched my kids screw up and would think to myself that they should not get promoted and then they end up getting promoted anyway. I’ve held my kids from belt testing on more than one occasion because I (emphasis on “I”) did not think they deserved to test. I feel like the philosophy there is the same as most organized sports for children nowadays; everyone is a winner and everyone deserves a trophy even if they suck. That is not what I want. I was them to be challenged. I want them to learn. And they are not. I put the boys in TR because it was near by, we liked the instructor and, well, we just didn’t know any better. The longer we are there, the more it has dawned on me that my kids are learning nothing substantive. The program is so superficial. They are bored with it. It irks the hell out of me because we have spent so MUCH freaking money there. In fact, I was set off today because they asked for additional money for the stupid website that is used to sign up for exams and see promotions. Granted, it is only $29.00, but, after what I spend in monthly fees, the amount of money they charge for belt exams, and the exorbitant amount of money we have spent on gear and uniforms, it then becomes just about principle. My husband told me about a year and half ago that he had read somewhere that if a TR black belt were to be in a fight with a black belt from unaffiliated school, that the TR BB would more than likely get his but kicked. I shrugged it off and wish I hadn’t. So, here are my questions: will my son’s TR black belt transfer to any other school after he gets it? If so, should I just keep him there until he gets it? If not, do you think then I should just cut my losses and move them? I want them to learn TKD, authentic TKD. I think that the art could teach them so much. And they want to learn. But, I seriously know nothing about it. You would think after years I would have picked up on something from TR. But, they don’t talk about any of these things. How do I know I’m picking the right place? What should I be looking for. I do not want to put them in another McDojo.

    Thanks for the help.

    By the way, I told my kids that TR is considered a McDojo and they immediately understood the reference. They have wanted to quit for so long. I’ve made them stick it out. When I asked them if they would want to continue TKD at another school, even if it meant that they would have to go back to white belts, they enthusiastically agreed. What does that tell you?

    • White Dragon says:

      Wow, I read your story. You really are dealing with a lot and TR is taking a toll on you. I recommend you quit.

      “Will my son’s TR black belt transfer to any other school after he gets it?”

      No. Like any mcdojang organization their ranks and titles only matter in their orgnizations. Nowhere else. You will not be allowed to transfer rank into any legitimate Taekwondo group. It is essentialy worthless outside of Tiger Rock. Sad fact. Same if it was American Taekwondo Association. Same stuff.

      “If so, should I just keep him there until he gets it?”

      Even if it did I would say no. Why waste time? Just go to another gym now and earn it there I would say. But since it does not transfer you might as well quit now because it won’t matter. But if you feel he should test an want to spend the money for whatever reason ok then. But still if you do that just find another gym to go to that teaches true Taekwondo.

      “If not, do you think then I should just cut my losses and move them?”


      “How do I know I’m picking the right place? should I be looking for?”

      True Taekwondo is a Korean martial art. If there are no Koreans then you are not learning Taekwondo most likely. Real Taekwondo came from Korea and is associated with the original KTA (Korea Taekwondo Association) which then expanded to create a World TAekwondo Academy which gives out international black belt ranks to foreigners. This WTA is called the Kukkiwon which is the Korean national Taekwondo style. The only real style. It is also allowed in the Olympics and is a member of the IOC. The Kukkiwon is directly related to the WTF, World Taekwondo Federation, which is the international sport organization for tournaments. But the martial art itself including self defense and everything else is directly developed through the Kukkiwon which is the only ranking organization for black belts worldwide. If you go to a Taekwondo gym and they are not Kukkiwon certified then do not go there.

      Now even if a dojang is Kukkiwon it does not mean the instructor will be good. Like any organiation the teaching quality of anyone differs from person to person. But a good Taekwondo gym ca be hard to find. Most only focus on olympic sparring rules tournaments or poomsae without understanding applications for fighting. But if you can find one that is Kukkiwon and teaches proper application of poomsae movements as well as realistic self defense and not only sport Taekwondo, then that is the best place.
      Even so, a school that focuses on Olympic sparring rules only for sparring can still instill a good fighting spirit in your children and develop them as young people. When they get older they can branch off into kickboxing or other things. Unfortunately many schools do not want to teach MMA type of kickboxing. But I do and there are others like us who do and believe Taekwondo is a true fighting art.

      Just keep reading my blog and thank you for your heartfelt comment! I understand your pain because any people feel the way you do and are disillusioned with their training and children’s training.

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